Family Vibes and Deep Dives: An Exclusive Interview with Gabbing Gilmore
A coffee chat with podcast duo (and sisters!) Catherine and Jackie!
We love listening to podcasts about our favorite shows. Whether a rewatch podcast that gives episode by episode commentary or deep dives on themes and character development, it’s enlightening to hear others’ perspectives on the content we love and expands our sense of community around fandom. And what we love even more is a podcaster duo, because in addition to commentary, we get to know new voices through their dynamic together as hosts.
If you’re a Gilmore Girls fan, you may be familiar with sisters Catherine and Jackie who host the podcast Gabbing Gilmore: A Gilmore Girls Deep Dive. Each episode is an in depth discussion about a topic or character where Catherine and Jackie consider a nuanced perspective. Their thoughtful conversations go beyond the show itself and incorporate their own life experiences both as young women when they watched for the first time and now as mothers themselves sharing the show with their own kids. They bring in perspectives on friendship, parenting, feminism, and more to each episode.
We had a fantastic discussion with Catherine and Jackie about their working relationship as cohosts, what they’ve learned about one another through making the podcast, and some of their favorite Gilmore dynamic duos! You can follow them on all podcast platforms and Instagram. Check out our conversation below, and don’t forget to subscribe to Gabbing Gilmore (and for more, check out their Patreon!).
Remarkist Editors: You two are quite the dynamic duo. Can you talk a bit about how you got started working together for a podcast? Had you worked together before? What were some of your fears or expectations when going into working with your sister?
Catherine and Jackie of Gabbing Gilmore:
Catherine: In a way, we’ve been working together forever! Growing up, we loved performing–dance recitals, plays, cheerleading, orchestra, choir. But our favorite moments were when we handled the creation, too. We constantly choreographed our own dances together to Paula Abdul and the Dirty Dancing soundtrack (that was an era, wasn’t it?) and even created a dance show as kids that we performed for the whole neighborhood. I guess we’ve always loved creating art together in our own little sister bubble and then sharing it with others, even if it was our extended family watching us dance to “Sleigh Ride” at Christmas dinner.
Jackie: It’s true. So let’s fast forward to 2010; we were navigating some of the typical adulthood milestones like careers, marriage, and children. Dancing a little less in those days! But we came together to create in a new way, by founding a non-profit organization after my son was diagnosed with autism. Together, with our dynamic mother at the helm, we created Autism Families CONNECTicut, which provides recreational and social activities for people on the autism spectrum ages 3-35. We’re proud to celebrate our 15 year anniversary this year.
Catherine: Along with that, we’d been talking for years about doing a project together about Gilmore Girls in some way. At every family gathering, we’d be making Gilmore references back and forth, sometimes just to see if the other one understood it. Then those conversations would get deeper. We’d ask, “did you hear what people online are saying about Rory?” And the idea started to take shape.
A couple years ago, I read the book Unicorn Space by Eve Rodsky with my book club. It has this cool activity where you match up random interests with your values. When I drew a line from “Gilmore Girls” to family, the idea struck me like lightning. A podcast with my sister! I called her up right away and Jackie agreed on the spot.
RE: Tell us a bit about the podcast and how your approach differs from other Gilmore Girls rewatch podcasts.
Jackie: We bring a different perspective as moms in our 40’s who have a little more lived experience under our belts. Catherine and I recently realized that we’re not all that much older than Rory, who would be 41 today, yet find ourselves relating more to Emily Gilmore than ever before! Our perspective is unique in that we watched the show when it aired, in our 20’s, revisited the show when it started streaming on Netflix in our 30’s, and now have a new perspective as women in our 40’s. Rather than produce another rewatch podcast (some great ones already exist!), we eagerly explore themes, character motivations and relationships, and social issues. My background as a social worker heavily influences my lens, and similarly for Catherine who specializes in gender equity, public policy that supports women and families, and social justice, you will hear all of this, along with our strong feminism values, throughout the podcast. We like to approach each topic and character with a fair perspective rather than hate. And fans know that there is a lot of Rory hate out there! We believe the fans are open and willing to engage in more nuanced discussions.
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RE: What is your Gilmore story? How did each of you become a fan?
Jackie: In 2001 I was in grad school and in between classes, internships and school work, was desperately in need of some good relaxing TV. I remember seeing the ads for Gilmore Girls on the WB and thinking, “why am I not watching this show?” I jumped into Season 2 and was hooked immediately. By the time the series ended in 2007, I had two little babies of my own and was into a new phase of life. So when it hit Netflix in 2014, I was so excited. My daughter was the perfect age to watch with me and we had some hilarious discussions as a result! I pretty much became a “constant looper” after that, starting with the pilot and watching straight through to the end. It was an easy show to have on while making dinner, or if my kids were in the room. And most importantly, it made me laugh.
Catherine: I remember being in law school and coming home tired at night to eat dinner with my mom. A couple times she said, “Jackie really likes this show, Gilmore Girls–should we watch it?” The funny thing was… after a long day of studying, reading, and debating, it was sometimes hard to absorb more words into my brain, with all that dialogue that Gilmore is famous for! Once I was fully done with school, I started to enjoy it more and watched the last two seasons real-time. I then filled up my entire “DVR” (remember that?) with episodes from ABC Family to keep watching it chronologically.
And, like Jackie, I started coming back to it at big points in my life, especially when I needed comfort: after giving birth and again in the pandemic. Now it’s just on a constant loop!
RE: What is something you learned from podcasting together that you didn’t know about the other, or something you discovered about your relationship from working together?
Catherine: I always knew that we loved to discuss deep topics together, but until we put two microphones in front of our faces, I’m not sure I realized how easy and thought-provoking our dynamic is together! Jackie is the easiest person in the world to talk to, and I hope that’s obvious on the podcast.
Another thing that I discovered about Jackie is how much she was open and willing to grow through this project. She’s tackled stuff that she had absolutely zero experience with, like sound editing. Our editing is top-notch (if I do say so myself!) because of her work. Jackie is also not a huge fan of public speaking. But she constantly stretches herself outside of her comfort zone, with live events, onstage appearances, and more. Her vibe went from “what are you asking me to do, Catherine?” to “Sure, let’s do it!” It’s a wonderful reminder to me that we can start anything new at any age!
Jackie: Thanks Cath! I can trust Catherine to lead me out of my comfort zone and I know she will keep me safe and have my back. (“Where you lead, I will follow…”)
I always knew my sister was highly academically inclined, intelligent, and extremely self-motivated. I mean, she started a business herself and runs it on her own! I just didn’t realize how driven she is. Once she has an idea in her mind, she will not rest until she has found the right answer. This was especially surprising when it came to technology, which is not an area I would have expected Catherine to excel. But excel she does! She’s picked it up so quickly, from graphic design, to creating all our content on socials, to researching the best platforms. Starting is always the hardest part of any project, and Catherine made it so much easier to get the podcast up and running with her drive and tireless persistence.
I also have to mention how much I admire Catherine’s creativity. She had already earned the nickname “Crafty” from my husband 20 years ago, so we knew she enjoyed crafting. But she is constantly surprising me with new ideas for the podcast, and I don’t just mean for episode content. Recently she created the Gabbing Gilmore Guide “How to Throw a GG Watch Party-the Ultimate Guide.” While I had a hand in the content, it was really Catherine’s idea, vision, and creation. Go check it out on our Patreon account!
RE: Has your opinion on any character or scenario from the show changed as a result of doing the podcast, perhaps due to discussions with each other or listener questions or comments? Can you point to a memorable shift?
Jackie: Gilmore Girls is famous for being a cozy show, warm lighting, beautiful outdoor seasonal sets, 2000’s-era outfits, coffee coffee coffee. It’s like a warm hug! For this reason, a large percentage of the fandom starts their annual rewatch in the fall for all the cozy vibes. However Catherine brought a new analysis to the topic and distinguished that the Gilmore Girls “cozy recipe” is really about environment, nourishment, traditions, and a sense of community and belonging. Beyond the aesthetic, Stars Hollow is a place where Rory and Lorelai (and many other townies) are held and accepted for who they are. It resonates with us as viewers who also desire a community that keeps us safe, that loves us, quirks and all! She accurately pinpointed the true reason the show has a massive following, and continues to reach new generations. It is a wise and important distinction. Catherine is truly gifted at thoughtfully breaking down large topics and giving them a fresh perspective. People can tune into Episode 63 to hear us gab all about it!
Catherine: Thanks, Jackie - that was a fascinating concept to dive into! I’m so grateful to Jackie’s perspective, based on her social work background and experience parenting teens, that has helped me to notice things I didn’t before. For example, in our very first episode, “Best Friends First: Lorelai and Rory,” Jackie helped me to see that the way Lorelai treats Rory–often as her closest friend and confidante–is admirable at first glance, but can have troubling consequences for Rory. After all, Rory’s a child when we meet her and often feels partial responsibility for major things in their life, like finances and the house.
And sometimes we arrive at a new stance together–just by talking on the pod! A recent instance of this was a discussion we had about Rory and her love of rules. After chatting for a while about her responses to criticism and her occasional rigidity, we realized that she sometimes uses these as a shield when she’s dealing with difficult emotions that she wants to distance herself from.
RE: Rory and Lorelai are undeniably the show’s main dynamic duo. Other than the Girls, who is your favorite duo (or partnership in crime!)?
Jackie: While the show is very wonderfully focused on the central female mother/daughter relationships between Rory, Lorelai, and Emily, I really enjoy the relational development between Luke and his nephew Jess. These are two men who initially have very little confidence in maintaining a long term healthy relationship with anyone in their lives. But through their bond, we see significant growth and development from Luke and Jess, both within their relationship with each other and with their willingness to accept love and community into their lives. And who doesn’t love the scene when Luke, first learning how to parent and relate to Jess, pushes him in the river? They have so many classic and heartfelt scenes together.
My honorable mention is Liz and TJ (IYKYK).
Catherine: So true about Luke and Jess, Jackie. One of my other favorite duos is Miss Patty and Babette. Not only are they best friend goals, but they epitomize the power of shame-free living in your 50s, 60s, and beyond. Because, really, people don’t talk enough about the benefits of aging. It might come with more random aches and pains, but Jackie and I have both experienced the beauty (and power) in giving less effs about what other people think. With every birthday, I care less and less about what other people think of me. Miss Patty and Babette embody that liberation so marvelously. It’s so refreshing for perfectionists and achievers like me, who’ve spent most of our lives trying to succeed and do all things we’re “supposed” to do. If they want to dominate karaoke, they do it. If they want to sing at the hockey game, they do it. If they want to talk about their sex lives, they do it. (Which is something we chatted about in depth in our early episode, “Sexuality of Women of a Certain Age.”)
I hope the younger viewers of Gilmore Girls notice Miss Patty and Babette’s confident, shame-free magnetism and feel inspired to own their individuality and uniqueness, too. To be honest, Rory could probably still benefit from this lesson, too.
RE: Which two characters, who don’t have much to do with each other, would make an amazing podcasting duo, in your opinion?
Jackie: I would love to watch Miss Patty and Paris Geller co-host a podcast! Remember when they share a scene back in Season 2 when Paris books Miss Patty’s dance studio as rehearsal space for the Chilton Shakespeare group to practice Romeo and Juliet. Their brief interaction left me wanting more! I imagine them debating the hot topics of the day, each with their own unique perspective. Miss Patty would never accuse Paris of yelling because she knows very well that’s just the natural register of her voice.
Catherine: I’d love to hear Brian and Kyon co-host a podcast. When they meet at Mrs. Kim’s house for Lunar New Year, we get a small taste of their natural chemistry that leaves the audience craving more. Their podcast would be a really hip crossover exploration of rock music and Korean culture. Brian would gently and sweetly expand Kyon’s musical interests from Avril Lavigne toward Blondie and The White Stripes. Meanwhile, Kyon would school Brian in KPop Demon Hunters, Big Ocean, and more. And we know he’s open-minded enough to dive right in. Can we make that happen?
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